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Post by oaxacalote on Apr 20, 2010 17:52:30 GMT -5
I'm living in Mexico and am looking for some quality beans to process into dark chocolate bars. Anyone have recommendations on what to look for? I'm looking into a trip to the small cacao-producing regions left in Oaxaca and am open to suggestions anywhere in Mexico.
The nibs I'm buying for my first chocolate making adventures are reportedly from Tabasco and Chiapas and are used locally for traditional drinking chocolate (with almonds and cinnamon) and moles.
And thanks to everyone in these forums for building such a pleasant and informative community. I've had a lot of fun reading through the archives since I discovered the site a few days ago.
Dave
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Post by cheebs on Apr 21, 2010 13:52:48 GMT -5
If you could get some Porcelana from Finca La Joya in Tabasco it would be quite a coup.
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Post by Sebastian on Apr 21, 2010 16:33:57 GMT -5
Once you find your source, you'll want to explore different fermentation regimens with them - anaerobic, 6 day fermentation, 3 day fermentation with daily heap turnovers, etc etc - the same bean will yield vastly different flavors depending how you have it fermented. Don't forget that sun drying is a very important step post-fermentation.
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Post by oaxacalote on Apr 22, 2010 8:33:31 GMT -5
Sounds like Porcelana from Finca La Joya is the Holy Grail of Mexican cacao. Thanks for putting me on their scent Cheebs! I wonder whether there are criollo beans floating around the internal market in Mexico or if they are all locked into exclusive export deals with the heavy weights.
Thanks for the fermentation tips Sebastian. I know this phase is pivotal for flavor, but not much more. I'm in need of a crash course in bean selection and production/fermentation techniques! For now, I guess I'll have to trust my nose.
Thanks again for the great insights - I'll sure to report back from the Mexican cacao trail!
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Post by cheebs on Apr 22, 2010 9:08:47 GMT -5
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Post by Sebastian on Apr 22, 2010 17:45:25 GMT -5
Not many people understand fermentation - and farmers almost certainly don't - lots of trade secrets here, and a very, very critical part of the process that almost everyone ignores. Remember also that well over 90% (or more!) of what people will purport to be Porcelana will not be (ask them how they know/what makes them believe it's Porcelana). If you've got someone in Mexico suggesting that they're growing pure Porcelana, I'll be you uno cervaza that it's not If, at the end of the day, you're happy with the beans flavor, however - does it's lineage ultimately matter (unless you're looking for something to put on a label - in which case it's probably good to really understand if it's Porcelana or not). If you're looking for real Porcelana, you're going to have to go much farther south, and it will be quite difficult for you to find.
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Post by oaxacalote on Apr 22, 2010 23:50:09 GMT -5
Sebastian It's pretty clear which way the incentives are running for cacao farmers, eh? Selling porcelana is good business regardless of whether it's what you produce! By "much further south" are you suggesting that there is no Porcelana to be found outside of Venezuela, or at least none in Mexico? cheebs After I scope things out close to home in Oaxaca, I'm going to make an expedition to Tabasco. Thanks for the link - I'm going to hunt down some of those farms on my own. Tour groups drive me batty. What do you guys know about Ceylan beans? Supposedly this hybrid constitutes 5% of production in Tabasco.
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Post by Sebastian on Apr 23, 2010 6:06:57 GMT -5
Not saying that there's none in Mexico - only that almost everything people represent as porcelana, isn't. It's funny, even amongst real porcelana, i've worked with dozens and dozens of samples, and most of them frankly don't produce a chocolate that's very good. Blind tasting supports that almost no one prefers it, but put a wrapper on it and let people know that it's porcelana, and they'll preferentially select it. Very strange - people buy what they don't like. The power of marketing
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Post by oaxacalote on Apr 24, 2010 22:07:20 GMT -5
The whimsy of consumerism - shaped more by social perceptions and "buzz" than frank assessment of the product itself.
I'll say that double-blind taste tests revolutionized wine purchasing in my househould. I look forward to experiencing cacao in the same way!
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Post by Brad on Apr 25, 2010 0:13:29 GMT -5
Hey Sebastian;
Do you think that negative results from blind tasting the porcelana against a premium chocolate come from the fact that the porcelana is drastically different than what the consumer would expect chocolate "to taste like", and as a result they tend to choose something with a taste they are more familiar with?
We've now sampled our porcelana side by side with our other 3 70%'s to over 800 people, and when doing so, prepare them for the difference in taste by telling them it's very different than what they would have thought chocolate to taste like. Most concur that they had no idea cocoa could have such diversity in flavour. About 50% like it and buy it because it's unique, but at the same time also buy something with a more "traditional" chocolate flavour.
I could be wrong, but I think sometimes it's important to prepare the customer for what they are about to taste - especially when it's so drastically different than what they've been eating all along.
Admitedly, it took a while for me to grow accustomed to the taste of the Porcelana we make into chocolate, and now after two years I still can't figure out what to do with it other than make bars with it. (I've tasted Amedei's Porcelana, and in comparison quite dislike theirs to be honest. The fact that it's VERY dark leads me to believe it's a blend, and not at all 100% porcelana beans. ) Ours ends up as a reddish brick color (which porcelana should be) and goes amazingly with a nice late harvest sherry, such as an Alvear.
Those are just my two bits.
Cheers! Brad.
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Post by oaxacalote on Apr 25, 2010 12:44:40 GMT -5
That's an interesting take, Brad. Certainly expectations play a weighty role in forging perceptions. Dark chocolate is itself an "acquired taste" for many people. Developing appreciation for diversity in your client base seems like a sound business strategy, as well as being a fascinating endeavor from a connoisseurship perspective.
Anyone else want to rant or rave about porcelana and/or pairings? Brad, can you share where your porcelana is from? I remember reading somewhere in the archives that you were hunting down some beans from Venezuela.
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Post by Sebastian on Apr 25, 2010 15:23:11 GMT -5
Certainly - as with most flavor grade chocolate, people either tend to love it or hate it - especially if their reference is a hershey bar "In home use test" is terminology given to seeing what people actually do with what they buy - they'll tell you one thing often, and do something completely different. Use tests normally indicate that people who buy porcelana do so for gifting - ie they want to give something that has a special connotation to it, and don't buy with the intent of consuming it themselves.
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Post by oaxacalote on Jun 19, 2010 11:59:43 GMT -5
An update - just got back from a brief trip to the Chontalpa region of Tabasco. Had a couple of great farm visits and spent the morning yesterday with Clara María Echeverría Díaz - the proprietress of La Joya. Brought home a sample batch of her beans and liquor (she's roasting and grinding on site) and am enjoying a cup of the coarse ground traditional drinking chocolate she's selling as I write this post. The flavor is subtle, but in my opinion far superior to the drinking chocolates made by Mayordomo and other factories here in Oaxaca, which are highly astringent. Thanks for the great tip cheebs!
Had the good fortune to have unknowingly planned my trip at the end of the year's first harvest so we saw a lot of fermentation in process and even sampled some fresh from the pod cacao pulp at la Joya - it was deliciously sweet and tangy. A lot of the beans were being put through very short fermentation cycles (2 and 3 days) and due to recent rains it seemed that everyone was machine drying - often at quite high temperatures. Understandably producers were anxious to minimize this but the one dryer with a thermometer put the burner temp at 100 C before being fed into the tumbler, so in essence this is a wet roasting process. My intuition is that I would have to be present for post-harvest processing to feel 100% certain of the fermentation and drying regime used. Seems like when it rains everyone machine dries as a matter of necessity.
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Post by charlieangel on Aug 9, 2010 13:39:50 GMT -5
Any word on the Maya tabasco tour site? the site now gives a "landing page".
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Post by oaxacalote on Sept 7, 2010 15:13:18 GMT -5
Not sure what you're referring to. There is a "ruta de cacao" tourism initiative in Tabasco that includes a number of farms organized to receive tourists, though nothing tailored for a chocolate connoisseur. I noticed an offering from multiple tour operators on the web and from my hotel when I was in Tabasco. If you speak Spanish and have a car, it's also very easy just to show up at the farms, though some of them only have tours organized at a specific time or with prior correspondence.
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