|
Post by Sun-Craft on Nov 12, 2013 16:28:13 GMT -5
I'm wondering if you have ever seen or used a colloid mill for conching? They're often used to grind and process nut butters and think it might have a dual purpose in conching chocolate too. They can recirculate pastes and liquids in a loop, and their grinder/mill is friction based, not blades. An example of one is listed here, and a video of the re-circulation is here. (the video is a bit loud, but it shows how a food (in this case cooked carrots) is made into a paste and then recirculated as long as required to attain a certain consistency and emulsification. I imagine this is also an excellent opportunity to blend ingredients as well. It's a pretty large ticket item but if we could kill two birds with one stone, so to speak, that would be pretty exciting!
Curious if anyone out there has tested this?
|
|
|
Post by Sebastian on Nov 13, 2013 6:22:01 GMT -5
i've used them to grind quite a bit. i don't think it'd be an effective conche if you used it in a closed loop, as neither the volatiles nor the moisture would then have any escape route. it would begin to generate a great deal of heat, w which you could mitigate with a water jacket on many models however.
|
|
|
Post by itsallaroundyou on Nov 14, 2013 16:46:02 GMT -5
I've been looking at the same machines for grinding and I can say that the re-circ is not a closed loop--at least on models I've seen the paste is "rained' back down into the funnel, exposing it to air for evaporation of volatiles etc...
I've never gotten to use one first hand, but wouldn't over refining become an issue? Or do they come standard with an adjustable gap?
|
|
|
Post by Sebastian on Nov 14, 2013 17:05:56 GMT -5
Everyone i've worked with has an adjustable gap..
|
|
|
Post by suncraft on Dec 10, 2013 13:59:20 GMT -5
So it seems like the colloid mill might just work... effective paste grinding (similar to a regular wet grinder - they're often used to make peanut butter, soy and other similar pastes), they recirculate allowing aeration, and they're often used to smooth and emulsify multiple ingredients together. I'm hoping to add paste ingredients into chocolate. If I'm right, this might allow me to create a paste, grind the nibs, conch and blend the final recipe, in one unit.
If only they weren't nearly $1,000 to buy and try out this theory! (half of which is shipping from China) Quite a gamble.
If I find out anything, I'll post here!
|
|
|
Post by leekohlbradley on Mar 29, 2014 9:32:16 GMT -5
Also interested in this possibility. There are models from China which claim to achieve 2 microns for <500 USD (before shipping on a 50kg unit!). Could volatiles be handled by ensuring ample ventilation of the hopper?
|
|
|
Post by Sebastian on Mar 29, 2014 14:51:19 GMT -5
I've ordered some of those models to test, and while they did remarkably well, i'd treat their 2um claims with some skepticism. The units are likely to arrive *VERY* dirty to you, so plan for a significant overhaul and clean of the machine prior to it's use. That said, once cleaned, i've found them to return acceptable results, esp for the $.
|
|
|
Post by leekohlbradley on Mar 30, 2014 17:28:37 GMT -5
That is interesting news indeed. The particle size claimed is actually 2~40um which makes more sense and leads me to believe that with enough time all particles would be on the curve.
I'm a bit of a clean freak so I wash all new equipment, molds, etc. regardless of their apparent cleanliness. Or filthiness.
Just out of curiosity, are you the Sebastian who answered my botulism question at TCL? :-)
|
|
|
Post by Sebastian on Mar 31, 2014 5:15:04 GMT -5
Yessir
|
|
|
Post by itsallaroundyou on Apr 16, 2014 12:30:14 GMT -5
Sebastian--would you be willing to post which models or company you bought from? I am interested in trying some out as well, but I've read horror stories about fraudulent companies in China that I worry I might pick a lemon.
|
|
|
Post by Sebastian on Apr 16, 2014 18:31:41 GMT -5
I've tried a great many of them mate, i'm not sure i've got them all memorized. If you're looking at a specific brand, shoot me an email and i'll let you know my experience with it. However, as with almost anything in China - just because it has a brand name on it doesn't mean that's what it actually is. I've seen entire factories all over China that exist for the sole purpose of knocking off products, quite convincingly actually.
|
|
madz
Neophyte
Posts: 1
|
Post by madz on Apr 29, 2020 2:10:32 GMT -5
Hello everyone. A vertical colloid mill functions well as a refiner, but (likely) not as a conche. I run a 300g test batch of nibs twice through a JML-50 colloid mill at its widest/coarsest setting. The particle size of the liquor after the first pass was around 110 microns, and was around 60 microns after the second pass. The yield after the second pass was about 170g, which equates to a loss of about 130 to the internals of the mill; this mill is used more efficiently with larger batches of nibs. The aperture of the hopper isn't very wide, at around 3 cm/1.25 inches: the nibs I used weren't crushed finely, so I had to stir those for the mill to load smoothly. Each pass took about 20-20 seconds. And the liquor had a consistent texture, and appeared suitable for loading onto a melangeur/edge runner mill, 3-roll mill, or ball mill for further refining. The particle size could probably be reduced further by passing the liquor 3 or more times at finer grind settings. However, I did notice several structural issues with the mill that are related to refining. First, the mill was not engineered to prevent the rotor and stator from coming into contact. Prior to the test, I tried to calibrate the machine at its finest setting, and I found no internal mechanism to prevent rotor-stator contact. The milling chamber is so small that not even a feeler gauge could be used to check clearances. I ended using a small strip of A4 paper, which is probably about 200 microns in thickness, but the risk of machine damage would be much higher if the clearance would be set much finer. Second, although the machine has a water inlet-outlet for cooling, it does not have a means to precisely regulate the temperature of the milling process. The factory/re-seller does not supply a water-cooling mechanism, or even the hoses to connect the mill to a cooling mechanism. Third, the machine does not have a pump or pressurised system for re-circulating the liquor through its re-circulation pipe. The mill was designed to produce soy milk: prior to the loading of the soy beans, the mill is filled with water, which settles at the same level in the hopper and the re-circulation pipe. The operation of the mill creates a vortex, and causes enough pressure for the water to cycle through the re-circulation pipe. This leveling does not occur when nibs are loaded into the mill: when the mill is operated with the re-circulation pipe, the nibs float on the partially-milled liquor. Nor does the vortex cause enough pressure for re-circulation to occur efficiently when cocoa liquor is loaded: it is too viscous, and the significant temperature differences between the cold hopper and re-circulation pipe at the one end, and the hot milling mechanisms at the other would cause clogging or reduced recirculation flow. More to the point, this colloid mill might not be the useful as a conche particularly for small-scale chocolate makers. The edges of the rotor and stator are very sharp, and are more difficult to clean than the rollers of a melangeur/edge-runner mill or the balls of a ball mill. And the mill is quite loud, probably somewhere between 85-100 decibels, or comparable to a wet/dry vacuum cleaner. Even a 12-hour conching cycle would be extremely uncomfortable, and even illegal in some places. I hope this helps
|
|